IANTD Free diving instructor course

[freediverND]

Excerpts From Freedive WI -
Where are you going to take the freediving instructor course? I emailed Tom Mount, president of IANTD, over a month ago and he never got back to me.
I e-mailed Tom several times and finally got an answer from Dan Hodgins, apparently Tom's right hand man in the free diving instructing. Got reply on cost, requirements, location, etc. I just e-mailed him another note with a ton of questions regading the IANTD Free diving Instructor Rating.

Divetech in Cayman is the only place that I know of who teaches it. I looked into it but whant to push my PB down to 120', from 105', to get their master instructor rating- goals for the summertime.

Seaview Dive Center, a new shop in the caymans, Dan H. and Tara C.. My goals too, -120' this summer, I'm sure I'd a hit -100' last summer if the weather would have cooperated when I had the support there, but for now it sits at -79' (the bottom). Maybe we could get to gether this summer and both push our p.bs.

Have you looked into Kirk's clinic yet? You could drive to Maimi and take it like I did a couple of years ago. That would be cheaper than Cayman and you could get the housing too. No instructor rating, but we don't need c-cards for freediving anyhow- just knowledge. I have stacks of c-cards and instructor ratings, but I learned more in one week with him than in any rec or tec class that I have ever taken in scubadiving- and that includes a 2 month long IDC that I did at PADI headquarters almost 20 years ago. It's really worth the money."

I have been communicating with Kirk, and I know his course would be great as I have met and dove with him before, but I have been asked by a local dive shop here if I would be interested in teaching free diving so I though maybe a piece of paper that says you're an instructor might be a good thing to have for those that think that a certificate makes you more knowledgeable, although the dive shop did not require it of me. Dan H. said that they would travel to put on the clinic and I have inquired for more information about that and if they will be putting on a clinic in Canada this summer.. where they will be going in June. I'm asking lots and lots of questions. If I went to Kirks clinic it would be later in the summer and out in California where one of my daughters lives, but I would prefer Florida

[FreediveWI]

Kirk and Dan are old bud's from Canada. Kirk went down to Cayman to set them up for trimix and nitrox once the govermnet ok'd it a few years ago.

While Kirk was working as Pipin's safety diver, at 400', he decided to try his hand at freedivng. He ended up writing the course material for IAFD. As everything with Pipin goes, it didn't work out. Kirk took the material over to IANTD, for which he was already an instructor trainer, and they adopted it.

The book from Kirk's clinic and the Advanced Freediving book from IANTD are almost identical. Kirk calls it a clinic and offers no c-card because everyone has different abilities. He sees it more like a tennis or ski clinic that one might attend to improve their game rather than just another c-card to add to the wallet.

Dan is also a good guy on the Canadian freediving team. If you can acutally find a shop to run a course through up there more power to you. I can barely find training partners down here, yet alone people willing to pay for a course.

Maybe we can meet at a sort of midpoint, Like Wazee, this summer. Last summer I had a friend of mine double her PB in one morning with me up there, 62'. I know that with the proper gear and a little training she can hit 100' easily.

I have talked to PADI , one of the orginizations that I teach through, about a freediving course a few years ago and they wanted nothing to do with it. Then again, they were against nitrox when it first came out and now they have a trimix course coming out this summer. ???

The video camera would be a great training tool for teaching diving. Kirk used it at the clinic, GUE instructors use it in their basic classes and another friend of mine uses it to teach all of his tec classes. There is no better way to improve than to watch what your doing wrong.

Jon

[FreediveWI]

Fred,

Another point with becoming an offical freediving instructor is dues and insurance. I spend more than a few hundred a year to keep up my dues and insurance to teach scuba. For freediving you'd have to be a dues paying member of IANTD AND carry their insurance to teach the class. I bet your talking an easy $500 a year to do that in the U.S., plus all of your course costs and travel expenses.

That's one reason why I like freediving so much. You don't need a c-card, or lots of overpriced gear, to do it. With the wealth of information on the internet you could almost teach yourself- if you had a buddy to spot you.

Make sure you can pay your costs back if you start teaching up there. The average scuba instructor only teaches for three years before they decide to hang it up because it's just not worth it for all of the time you put in. Most of us view it as a labor of love.

That's also why you see some really sloppy scuba classes out there with no classroom sessions and only one pool session before people hit the lake. Many instructors don't put in the time to do it right because they make nothing off of the course to begin with.

[freediverND]

Jon,
I think you and I have each done a lot of teaching ourselves this discipline of freediving. Even after you've taken Kirk's clinic I know you read avidly on deeperblue and other sources as I do and we're always adding to the knowledge we have of freediving, hence, we are always learning one more thing we could teach. After corresponding with IANTD and doing the best to relay my experience/abilities/knowledge, I was told I could most likely be moved right into their MFD instructor course and run the MFD course concurrently, more so as a review, and it sounded like it could all be done for the cost of the MFD Inst. course.
A course may be available up in B.C. this June...
I still want to take a clinic or the IANTD course... just trying to figure out which is best for me.

Say, speaking of insurance... do you suppose if you became an "official" freediving instructor, that you would open yourself to more liability than if you were not. I think so. Right now, it's all buddy buddy, not "official instructor" - student. Maybe another reason to take one of Kirk's clinics instead of the IANTD program.

I guess if I became an instructor (not that you need a cert to be an instructor.. I always figure if you know just 1 thing more than the other, you have something to teach, and if the other person knows just one thing more than you, you have something you can learn and they can teach). I wouldn't be doing it for the money or worrying about paying costs. I would be doing it to learn that one more thing, and to have a little piece of paper that could give some legitimacy to teaching. For most folks I would think that being able to freedive to -100' or more and hold you breath for close to 4 minutes or more would definitely put you in a position that you might have something to teach. I suppose, if I were to start teaching, there might always be someone who would say something about what are your qualifications!!? I guess that's the time to say that if you can dive to -100' or more and hold your breath for 4 minutes I have nothing to teach you.. but if you can't get past -30' or -50', or hold your breath for a couple of minutes.. I can teach you.

I think I could be a good instructor. Cert or no cert, doesn't really make to much difference to me. I love this freediving and the few times I have gotten to take someone under the water with me it has be super rewarding. That's what it would all be about.

I think the ice might have come off the area lakes today.. 85 deg. here!
Might be able to get into the water on Tues or Wed. I'm fired up!!

Fred

[FreediveWI]

Taking the course through Dan or kirk would teach you a lot and let you test your limits with the proper safety divers around.

I know that I could teach it, I am just not convinced that I could break even around here with the extra expenses.

If your working with your buddies to help them get deeper and feel more comfortable I think that your fine. As soon as you start collecting any money to teach something you open yourself up for all of the libabililty issues that come with living in the USA. We see it all of the time on the boats out in Lake Michigan. As soon as someone has their friends chip in for gas the Coast Guard considers them a boat for hire and you need a captain's license. People break this rule all of the time until something goes wrong and the lawyers come out.

Taking the course in Cayman would be really nice because the water is so warm and clear that I know you would add a ton of depth onto your PB. Doing it in B.C. would be tougher. I've dove and kayaked up in that area and the water is cold and dark. THe best vis is in the winter around there because all of the alge is dead. When Eric F. set his record up there he did it in 3' of vis.

I know that Kirk taught a class in Ottowa last summer. That would be closer from Wisconsin, but maybe not from where you live.

You could always get the instrucotr rating and teach for a year or so. IF it doesn't pay back you can still say you were a freediving instructor.

One thing that I have learned after almost 20 years of diving is that being an instrucotr doesn't mean much when it comes to diving skills. I have seen plenty of instructors, tek instructors, instructor trainers, ect. who just plain suck in the water. Many of them can't even put their own gear on and I bet a lot of them couldn't pass their instructor swim test after a couple years on the job. Almost every freediver I have ever met, if they have a c-card or not, is 10 times better in the water than 95% of the scuba instructors that I know.

Working on a charter boat has allowed me to see, and rescue, more than my share of divers and c-cards mean nothing. The more money people have the more cards they can buy. I think you had the right idea when comparing your abilities and what you can teach/learn from others.

Hoping to get out and dive today. It is going to get up to about 80 and the ice is off the lakes.

Jon

[FreediveWI]

Fred,

There are a couple of other really good courses out there.

Ahron and MT Solomons are now teaching a course down in Baha. They usually only teach in Greece or Israel.

They are camping out south of La Paz all summer long. They have spent a lot of time working with Russian monofin coaches to improve their technique. They can both pull off 200' constant dives and Ahron is over 60 years old.

La Paz is a great place to dive with mantas and seals. The water is warm and flat throughout the summer. You need to be prepared to camp with them if you take the course.

The course that I woud really like to take is taught by Umberto Pellizzari in Italy. He has week long courses at his Apnea Acadamies. He only teaches a few of them each year in English. It will be a long time before I can get away for one of his classes.

Loic Leferme teaches a no-limits sled course in Nice, France. That would be the easy way to go to 200'! 8)
You can book his courses on FREEDIVE UK's website.

J.J. Mayol used to teach courses down in Florida at Captain Slate's place. I haven't heard about him running anything since his dad died.

I think that Tanya has stopped teaching her course in Texas because it was to hard to coordinate things inbetween world record attempts.

Kirk still seems to have one of the best programs that are taught on a regular basis.

Dan's spot in Cayman would be a blast from a pure relaxation standpoint. I guess that they have lines set up down there on all of these different reefs. As you get more comfortable you keep moving out to the next reef. The water is flat and warm. I think that they don't even use boats to get to the lines. They just use the dive scooters to take them out and help with their warm-up dives. I know that Kirk said they used to dive the Carrie Lee (195'-265') while freediving with scooters down there. Everything is very close to shore compared with other places.

When I was in Miami we had to go out a few miles to find 300' of water to train in. While we were doing our 100' dives Eric Fattah was doing 220' warm ups on the line next to us. The support boat had to keep a look out for other boat traffic and be mindful of the powerful gulfstream current while we were out there. You wouldn't really have to worry about any of that down in Cayman.

Jon

[FreediveWI]

Fred,
As you may know, Mandy-Rae is now working for PADI headquarters.

Since she is already a Course Director, and multi record holder, I was wondering if she was going to open PADI up for freediver training. I asked someone I knew at headquarters about this a few years ago, PADI freediver classes, and he just laughed as it was too dangerous, of course this was before PADI came out with their own tec-deep and trimix classes. I have a feeling that it might be a different story now.
An instructor on another list told me that he contacted PADI more recently and they allow you to teach their "skindiver" course to a max depth of 130'! That means I could already teach it and you would only need to become a PADI assistant instructor to teach it- much cheaper than a trip to Cayman for the IANTD class.

I was blown away by that technicality, but I understand that it's possible to do. ???

Thought that you'd be interested,

Jon

[freediverND]

Funny you should bring this up today as earlier today I was looking into the clinics again. Are you sure that was 130'... or was it 30'? What's involved in becoming a PADI asst. instructor? I'll do a search w/google.
Thanks for the update.
Fred